Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

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Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Thu Dec 16, 2010 7:15 am

Everything was already decided, and it was planned.

http://old.nabble.com/PulseAudio-in--extra--td30214159.html
PulseAudio in [extra]
by Jan Steffens-2 Nov 14, 2010; 09:11pm :

I would like to propose moving support for the PulseAudio sound server into
Arch Linux proper. This would also be in preparation for the eventual arrival of
Gnome 3, since it will be unlikely we can effectively maintain the needed
GStreamer patch any more.


To that effect I have created a plan:

---

To provide PulseAudio in [extra]...

Move the following packages from [community] to [extra]:
- libasyncns
- rtkit
- pulseaudio (split into pulseaudio and libpulse)
- alsa-plugins
- pulseaudio-alsa
Configuration package, contains /etc/asound.conf
depends on pulseaudio, alsa-plugins
- pavucontrol
- paprefs
- pulseaudio-mixer-applet
- ossp
provides osspd OSS emulator

Rebuild the following packages with PulseAudio support:
- sdl (sdl-pulse in AUR)
- openal (openal-pulse in AUR)
- libgstreamer0.10-good
split gstreamer0.10-pulse (in community)
- libao
split libao-pulse (in community)
- libcanberra
split libcanberra-pulse (in community)
will be a split plugin instead of a wholly rebuilt copy
- gnome-media
split gnome-media-pulse (in community; rebuilt with --enable-pulse)
- gnome-settings-daemon
split gnome-settings-daemon-pulse (in community; rebuilt without
gstreamer patch)


Provide the following groups:
- pulseaudio-gnome
pulseaudio-alsa
libcanberra-pulse
gstreamer0.10-pulse
gnome-media-pulse
gnome-settings-daemon-pulse

---

One of the problems of PulseAudio is that it pretty much becomes the default as
soon as you install it:
- The client library will start the server if it's not running.
- pulseaudio will install .desktop files that autostart the server together
with Gnome or KDE.


Splitting libpulse would prevent that, but I believe we still need to test
on a per-application basis whether we can enable PulseAudio support (with a
dependency on libpulse) without breaking fallback to ALSA on systems without
pulseaudio.

Some packages (like sdl and openal) look for libpulse dynamically and will
still work even though the lib is missing, so they only need an optional
dependency.

I would be maintaining split -pulse packages where needed.


http://old.nabble.com/Re:-PulseAudio-in--extra--p30222200.html
by Ionuț Bîru-2 Nov 15, 2010; 08:12pm
like Jan pointed out, it would be a paint in the ass to maintain
unsupported patch that is adding support back for gstreamer(like we do
now and is not the arch way)


Jan Steffens has also another "pain in the ass". He compiled VLC player for Arch with PulseAudio http://www.archlinux.org/packages/extra/i686/vlc/
As a result, his VLC player does not play any DVDs (encrypted, or not-encrypted). This is exactly what "The Arch Way" means in this particular case.

NOTE: It turned out that DVD playback with VLC now depends on hardware. On one computer it works invariably (before upgrade and after), on another computer with the same software installed (except for hardware related things) and configured in the same way, you need to recompile VLC to enable playback of DVDs and MPEGs.

If "The Arch Way" is painful for the ass, it might be much more painful with PulseAudio.

To patch "gnome-settings-daemon", one may need a minimal knowledge in programming and some minimal knowledge in Linux. Taking into account the "pain in the ass" caused by VLC, one may imagine how painful "The Arch Way" might be with Gnome 3.

The patches for "gnome-settings-daemon" are still available (in the Attachment). One may open those patches with MELD http://meld.sourceforge.net/ and see that nothing special is inside. If they cannot make such patches, they would not be able to fix VLC, Audacity and many other multimedia applications. This actually means that multimedia applications may fail to work on Arch Linux in the near future.

EDIT: It makes sense to recompile (and rename) all the infected packages:
Code: Select all
sdl 
openal 
gstreamer0.10-good
libao
libcanberra
gnome-media
gnome-settings-daemon
fluidsynth
mpd
mplayer
mplayer-vaapi
phonon
and so on.


"libpulse" should be removed. Otherwise, infection will spread like malware.
The problem is that many multimedia packages (Mplayer, VLC, SDL, etc.) are designed in such a way that, if you have "libpulse", they would be automatically compiled with PulseAudio. If you compile something from AUR, you may get PulseAudio, if you do not take preventive measures.

It is not difficult to recompile all the infected packages. PKGBUILDs are available.
The package "gstreamer0.10-good" seems to be buggy on Arch Linux. If you have problems with compilation, you may try to add special options to "./configure" like these:
Code: Select all
--build=i686-pc-linux-gnu  \
--host=i686-pc-linux-gnu


When you try to recompile multi-media packages infected with PulseAudio, you may inevitably notice very strange mistakes in PKGBUILDs. For example, "makedepends" does not contain PulseAudio or libpulse, but, nevertheless, "depends" includes libpulse.

Code: Select all
# $Id: PKGBUILD 35386 2010-12-19 18:07:35Z foutrelis $
# Maintainer: Evangelos Foutras <foutrelis@gmail.com>
# Contributor: Ionut Biru <ibiru@archlinux.org>
# Contributor: Hugo Doria <hugo@archlinux.org>

pkgname=mplayer-vaapi
pkgver=32723
_vaapi_version=20101115
pkgrel=1
pkgdesc="A movie player, compiled with vaapi support"
arch=('i686' 'x86_64')
url="http://www.splitted-desktop.com/~gbeauchesne/mplayer-vaapi/"
license=('GPL')
depends=('libxxf86dga' 'libxxf86vm' 'libmad' 'cdparanoia' 'libxinerama' 'sdl'
         'lame' 'libtheora' 'xvidcore' 'libmng' 'libxss' 'libgl' 'smbclient'
         'aalib' 'jack' 'libcaca' 'x264' 'faac' 'lirc-utils' 'ttf-dejavu'
         'libxvmc' 'enca' 'opencore-amr' 'libdca' 'a52dec' 'schroedinger'
         'libvpx' 'libpulse' 'libva')
makedepends=('unzip' 'mesa' 'live-media>=2010.01.13' 'yasm' 'ladspa')
provides=("mplayer=$pkgver")
conflicts=('mplayer')
backup=('etc/mplayer/codecs.conf' 'etc/mplayer/input.conf')
source=(http://pkgbuild.com/~foutrelis/mplayer-$pkgver.tar.xz
        http://www.splitted-desktop.com/~gbeauchesne/mplayer-vaapi/mplayer-vaapi-$_vaapi_version.tar.bz2
        mplayer.desktop
        mplayer.png
        patch-fixes.patch)
md5sums=('1a0ece6c19d32281590f35495d7fbe36'
         '372ba02746404d3fa2b3aa94657a2efd'
         '647b9f4ab5284a7fef3f84f992214e77'
         'd00874ccc644b7f43d6ef1c942fcef28'
         'cbddc2d8b1140e274a2784bdbb1f9b04')

build() {
  cd "$srcdir/mplayer-$pkgver"

  # Custom CFLAGS break the mplayer build
  unset CFLAGS LDFLAGS

  # Update vaapi patches for changes introduced in mplayer
  patch -d "$srcdir/mplayer-vaapi-$_vaapi_version" -p1 -i \
    "$srcdir/patch-fixes.patch"

  for patch in mplayer-{vaapi{,-{gma500-workaround,0.29}},vdpau}; do
    patch -Np1 -i "$srcdir/mplayer-vaapi-$_vaapi_version/patches/$patch.patch"
  done

  ./configure --prefix=/usr \
      --enable-runtime-cpudetection \
      --disable-gui \
      --disable-arts \
      --disable-liblzo \
      --disable-speex \
      --disable-openal \
      --disable-fribidi \
      --disable-libdv \
      --disable-musepack \
      --disable-esd \
      --disable-mga \
      --enable-xvmc \
      --disable-vdpau \
      --enable-vaapi \
      --language=all \
      --confdir=/etc/mplayer

  [ "$CARCH" = "i686" ] &&  sed 's|-march=i486|-march=i686|g' -i config.mak

  make
  make -j1 DESTDIR=$pkgdir install
  install -Dm644 etc/{codecs.conf,input.conf,example.conf} "$pkgdir/etc/mplayer/"
  install -dm755 "$pkgdir/usr/share/mplayer/"
  ln -s /usr/share/fonts/TTF/DejaVuSans.ttf "$pkgdir/usr/share/mplayer/subfont.ttf"
  rm -rf "$pkgdir/usr/share/mplayer/font"
  # Desktop file (FS#14770)
  install -Dm644 "$srcdir/mplayer.desktop" "$pkgdir/usr/share/applications/mplayer.desktop"
  install -Dm644 "$srcdir/mplayer.png" "$pkgdir/usr/share/pixmaps/mplayer.png"
}

# vim:set ts=2 sw=2 et:


At the first glance, it looks like "libpulse" was merely planted in the dependencies. It may surely enhance your natural inclination to paranoia, if you have it. You may also notice other "obvious mistakes" (in "libcanberra-oss" as well). This may make you even more suspicious about Arch Linux.

It might be stating the obvious, but PulseAudio is fist of all a security problem:

Clever attack exploits fully-patched Linux kernel
'NULL pointer' bug plagues even super max versions
By Dan Goodin • Friday 17 Jul 2009 22:32

...The exploit works only when a security extension knows as SELinux, or Security-Enhanced Linux, is enabled. Conversely, it also works when audio software known as PulseAudio is installed. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/17 ... l_exploit/


Security-Enhanced Linux (SELinux)... developed by the United States National Security Agency, it was released to the open source development community under the GNU GPL on December 22, 2000 and merged into the mainline kernel 2.6.0-test3, released on 8 August 2003. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security-Enhanced_Linux


CryptoSystem Backdoors (Security Now! podcast) http://www.grc.com/sn/sn-268.htm
Description: Steve and Leo discuss the deeply troubling recent news of possible legislation that would require all encrypted Internet communications, of any kind, to provide a means for U.S. law enforcement "wiretap" style monitoring.
High quality (64 kbps) mp3 audio file URL: http://media.GRC.com/sn/SN-268.mp3
Quarter size (16 kbps) mp3 audio file URL: http://media.GRC.com/sn/sn-268-lq.mp3


OpenBSD founder Theo de Raadt wrote that a firm was probably contracted to put backdoors in OpenBSD project code, but it is unlikely the flaws made it very far if they existed. http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Security/OpenB ... rs-405542/


FBI 'planted backdoor' in OpenBSD
Posted in Enterprise Security, 15th December 2010 13:12 GMT

Allegations that the FBI may have smuggled back doors or weaknesses into openBSD's cryptography have created uproar in the security community. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/15 ... oor_claim/


OpenBSD backdoor claims: bugs found during code audit
By Sam Varghese
Friday, 17 December 2010 09:31

The OpenBSD project has found two bugs during an audit of the cryptographic code in which, it has been alleged, the FBI, through former developers, was able to plant backdoors.
OpenBSD project head Theo de Raadt told iTWire: "We've been auditing since the mail came in! We have already found two bugs in our cryptographic code. We are assessing the impact. We are also assessing the 'archeological' aspects of this.." http://www.itwire.com/opinion-and-analy ... dit-begins


OpenBSD Founder Believes FBI Built IPsec Backdoor
By Mathew J. Schwartz , InformationWeek
December 22, 2010 11:45 AM

The OpenBSD project has found two bugs in how OpenBSD, a Unix-like open source operating system, implements Internet protocol security (IPsec).
The bugs are of interest given the recent allegation made by Gregory Perry, former CTO of now-defunct Federal Bureau of Investigation contractor Network Security Technology (NetSec), that the FBI created a backdoor in the OpenBSD code base, specifically in how it implements IPsec. He also alleged that multiple developers involved in contributing code to OpenBSD were on the payroll of NetSec, and that the FBI had hired it to create the backdoors. http://www.informationweek.com/news/sec ... ed_IWK_All


Taking into account that security experts are professional paranoids, you can imagine what kind of "paint in the ass" it might be for Ionuț Bîru, Jan Steffens et al. who planted "libpulse" in multi-media packages for Arch Linux.

It might be much easier to patch "gnome-settings-daemon" (for Gnome 3) than to prove that "backdoors" have not been smuggled into Arch Linux.

Allegations of OpenBSD Backdoors May be True, Updated | Linux Journal
22 Dec 2010 ... It was just last week that Theo de Raadt, OpenBSD founder and developer, posted an email that claimed the Federal Bureau of Investigations ... http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/all ... ay-be-true


OpenBSD chief believes contractor tried to write backdoors | ITworld
22 Dec 2010 ... Discussing allegations, Theo de Raadt says that government contractor Netsec 'was probably contracted to write backdoors'...
...If there is a 10-year-old back door in OpenBSD, it would be hard to identify, as it would probably look just like any other security vulnerability. But it would give anyone who knew about it a way to eavesdrop on supposedly secure Internet communications -- VPN traffic, for example -- that used the buggy software. http://www.itworld.com/operating-system ... -backdoors


An FBI backdoor in OpenBSD?
...at this point, it seems that nobody but Perry really knows what's going on. It's hard to really know what to say at this point. We're talking about backdoors that probably just look like regular old bugs in code that was written 10 years ago. http://blogs.csoonline.com/1296/an_fbi_ ... in_openbsd


To summarize:
A. backdoors are indistinguishable from "regular old bugs" (side channel leakage http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Side_channel_attack )
B. the only available information is Perry's letters:
1. Gregory Perry to Theo de Raadt:
http://marc.info/?l=openbsd-tech&m=129236621626462&w=2
2. Gregory Perry to Robert McMillan:
http://blogs.csoonline.com/1296/an_fbi_ ... in_openbsd
The latter was republished by "Full Disclosure":
Full Disclosure: Perry explains OpenBSD backdoor more
http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2010/Dec/441

Thus, the only objective fact (available for us) is that certain letters contain really shocking information (which is impossible to verify). All other publications are mere subjective interpretations of somebody's words. There is, however, another fact:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/11/16/random_number_backdoor_fears/
Crypto guru warns over random number backdoor
By John Leyden • 16th November 2007 19:19 GMT

A top cryptographer has expressed concern about a possible backdoor in a standard for random-number generators approved by the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) this year...

Shumow and Ferguson described their finding as a weakness and are at pains to avoid suggestions that NIST intentionally put a back-door in the function. Schneier is less circumspect saying that the "algorithm contains a weakness that can only be described a backdoor".


http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/08/27/ssh_key_attacks_warning/
CERT: Linux servers under 'Phalanx' attack
By Dan Goodin in San Francisco • 27th August 2008 00:13 GMT

The CERT advisory makes no mention of the flaw in the Debian random number generator, but that's most likely the starting point for the attack.


Does the study of source code make any sense? Imagine that you have a kind of PulseAudio (or other useless thing installed). You may get a backdoor (which may "look just like any other security vulnerability") together with an update, and it might be removed with the next update. Since PulseAudio is fundamentally buggy, a backdoor might be indistinguishable from other bugs. Even if you are able to read and understand the source code, it might be very difficult to detect a backdoor, before your system is pwned. If you are a true paranoid, you have to remove almost all software and study the source code of each update, before it is installed.

libpulse does produce new problems (not to mention PulseAudio)
https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=110398

What is more, it seems that libpulse tends to behave like a trojan, or rootkit, and, therefore, you may get warnings from rkhunter, see:
http://forums.techguy.org/linux-unix/88 ... found.html
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+sour ... bug/559545

By planting "libpulse" into Arch Linux, the Arch developers made it clear that the KISS principle is already abandoned, and the Arch Way too https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Be ... e_Arch_Way
All such principles are nothing more than an ideological deception.
Do you remember Ubuntu's "humanism"? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_(philosophy)
Attachments
gnome-settings-daemon.tar.bz2
Patches for "gnome-settings-daemon" with PKGBUILD
(10.86 KiB) Downloaded 617 times
igorzwx
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby frabato56 » Mon Apr 11, 2011 2:24 pm

Hi,

These are interesting and (I believe) valid observations. About 6 months ago I moved from arch to debian sqeeze. May I ask which distro you favor?

Thanks
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Mon Apr 11, 2011 4:12 pm

frabato56 wrote:Hi,

These are interesting and (I believe) valid observations. About 6 months ago I moved from arch to debian sqeeze. May I ask which distro you favor?

Thanks


Debian might be problematic in the near future. It is a kind of "stable" Ubuntu. Right?

Canonical/Ubuntu has chosen to disable OSS support in their kernels and ignore any bugs filed against OSS4 packages. If you're considering using OSS4, you should probably use another Linux distro like Arch Linux. This page remains for historical/reference reasons. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/OpenSound


Debian packaging is time consuming. It was very difficult to recompile certain packages to remove PulseAudio from Ubuntu 9.10, see: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3375
Arch is much easier (in this sense). I am still using Arch. I had to recompile a dozen multimedia packages to remove libpulse and PulseAudio. Now I simply update my own packages.
Now I am busy with Linphone. To fix video playback, you have to compile x264, FFmpeg, Linphone, and magic codecs from git, and remove PulseAudio and ALSA from Linphone. Now sound quality is fantastic (with the magic plugin), video quality is also good (but there are still some bugs in the video codec to be fixed). Since Skype is not going to support OSS4, it makes sense to search for alternatives. If somebody needs packages or PKGBUILDs, I could upload them or send by e-mail.

Zfone encryption works well with Linphone (both audio and video)
http://zfoneproject.com/getstarted.html
http://zfone.com/faq.html#vbr

"Skype's misleading security assurances continue to expose users around the world to unnecessary and dangerous risk," says Privacy International's human rights and technology advisor, Eric King... Skype's VBR audio compression codec is particularly vulnerable, claims PI, regardless of how it's encrypted. Indeed, it says, phrases can be identified between 50 and 90 percent of the time. http://www.tgdaily.com/security-feature ... into-skype
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby frabato56 » Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:49 am

Thanks for the reply,

I used arch for about two years but I haven't been able to install it with a working xorg for about 6 months. I tried a network install a couple of weeks ago and the problem is still there (a black screen). No one in the forums could help (and as you know the arch linux folks are as helpful and knowledgeable as they come). For now debian does what I want it to do with only a few minor irritations. I have an m-audio delta 44 with the ice1712 chipset and pulseaudio just doesn't work. It's been broken for at least a couple of years so I'm not too hopeful that they will get around to fixing it. Pulseaudio is indeed like a disease, it's a shame that so many distros are adopting it. All of my music is on my computer which is hooked up to a hafler amp and preamp and at least with my setup I can clearly say that oss4 sounds better than alsa. I'm a musician so sound is very important to me. I've been running linux for about 12 years now and I can get around on just about any distro so if something goes wrong with debian/oss4 I'll just switch to whatever works. Thanks again for your detailed reply.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Tue Apr 12, 2011 1:31 pm

frabato56 wrote:I used arch for about two years but I haven't been able to install it with a working xorg for about 6 months. I tried a network install a couple of weeks ago and the problem is still there (a black screen).


There might be problems of the sort. In this case, Arch LiveCDs might be very helpful viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3933

frabato56 wrote:No one in the forums could help (and as you know the arch linux folks are as helpful and knowledgeable as they come)... Pulseaudio is indeed like a disease, it's a shame that so many distros are adopting it... I've been running linux for about 12 years now and I can get around on just about any distro so if something goes wrong with debian/oss4 I'll just switch to whatever works. Thanks again for your detailed reply.


Those "helpful and knowledgeable" linux users may not like PulseAudio and, therefore, they may not use Arch Linux anymore. If you have to recompile all multimedia packages to remove PulseAudio and fix bugs, it might be easier to install Gentoo. You may try it too, if you have a second computer for experiments.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby cesium » Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:46 pm

The relation between Debian and Ubuntu is precisely the reverse: Debian is the 'master' distro, and Ubuntu is a packaging of a part of that + additions from Canonical (typically stuff not liked by Debian's DFSG policies). I'm not surprised Ubuntu goes this direction, but I don't think it has any effect on Debian.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:12 pm

cesium wrote:The relation between Debian and Ubuntu is precisely the reverse: Debian is the 'master' distro, and Ubuntu is a packaging of a part of that + additions from Canonical (typically stuff not liked by Debian's DFSG policies). I'm not surprised Ubuntu goes this direction, but I don't think it has any effect on Debian.


I am not a specialist in master-slave relationships between distros, but this is certainly a misleading simplification. Debian is taking kernels, basic utilities and everything else from Red Hat Linux. Right?
The developers of Linux kernel, ALSA and PulseAudio are employed by Red Hat. Right?
Could you please explain what it means for OSS4 and OSS4 users?
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby cesium » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:31 pm

Well, Debian is one of the oldest distros out there (IIRC, only Slackware is older and still alive), and it has its own policies. Red Hat does sponser a lot of software, and Debian will usually provide it, but I found it to be flexible for a binary distro and allow opting out if I want to (there's even a Debian/FreeBSD variant which can't use much RH stuff anyway). This flexibility does allow a lot of distros based on Debian, and some have different goals. Ubuntu is tied up with Gnome (their KDE support is abysmal), and they tend to follow the same tech path (IIRC, the Gnome mixer applet removed support for everything but Pulse sometime ago? Don't recall now).
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:29 pm

cesium wrote:Well, Debian is one of the oldest distros out there (IIRC, only Slackware is older and still alive), and it has its own policies. Red Hat does sponser a lot of software, and Debian will usually provide it, but I found it to be flexible for a binary distro and allow opting out if I want to (there's even a Debian/FreeBSD variant which can't use much RH stuff anyway). This flexibility does allow a lot of distros based on Debian, and some have different goals. Ubuntu is tied up with Gnome (their KDE support is abysmal), and they tend to follow the same tech path (IIRC, the Gnome mixer applet removed support for everything but Pulse sometime ago? Don't recall now).


Your term "flexibility" means "the freedom of choice". Right?
The Debian Packaging System means very little freedom for ordinary users, for it might be very difficult for them to modify Debian packages.

Gnome seems to be sponsored by Microsoft http://techrights.org/2009/09/10/miguel ... -codeplex/

On October 25, 2010, Mark Shuttleworth announced that future versions of the Ubuntu operating system would use the Unity Desktop instead of GNOME Shell. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNOME_Shell#Reception

In short, a kind of "general confusion".

OSS4 seems to work well on Arch Linux. There are significant improvements in Xorg.
The so-called "input hotplugging" seems to work now with the newest Xorg.
However, the most of multimedia packages in Arch Linux appear to be broken or buggy.
You may borrow sources (or patches) from Debian and compile them on Arch.
This is how Arch developers created mplayer-vaapi (it is also infected with libpulse)
http://www.archlinux.org/packages/commu ... yer-vaapi/

The problem is that OSS4 users may want to have multimedia working. Right?
Another problem is web conferencing. This is what many users really need today.
Yate and Linphone seem to be promising.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby frabato56 » Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:36 pm

Debian is not as fast as arch, at least not on my machine (2.4 quad) but it's not bad. I wasn't able to get audacity to work with oss4 and I wasn't able to get ardour to work because I couldn't get jackd to work with oss4. I don't care much about those things any more. After 10 years of trying to work with audio and midi on linux, I bought cubase and I run it on windows7. What a difference, I now spend my time composing music instead of recompiling kernels with realtime privileges. Okay, minirant done. Here's what does work on debian with oss4, rhythmbox, GNU solfege, smplayer, xine and that's enough to keep me happy right now. Having to recompile multimedia apps on arch doesn't sound like much fun. One of the other reasons I switched from arch is that I got tired of my machine breaking on every second or third "pacman -Syu". Arch has a lot of packages but if they are in AUR you might as well flip a coin. Maybe it will build, maybe it won't. This new pulseaudio business with arch isn't very appealing to me. With all that complaining, I still have to say that I have a real fondness for arch and that community and I guess that nothings perfect. Still if anyone has a distro that they like besides arch or debian please let me know as I still like playing around with distros of all types just for fun. I don't have a spare machine but for those who like to tinker, clonezilla is a very handy tool.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:58 pm

frabato56 wrote:Debian is not as fast as arch, at least not on my machine (2.4 quad) but it's not bad. I wasn't able to get audacity to work with oss4 and I wasn't able to get ardour to work because I couldn't get jackd to work with oss4. I don't care much about those things any more. After 10 years of trying to work with audio and midi on linux, I bought cubase and I run it on windows7. What a difference, I now spend my time composing music instead of recompiling kernels with realtime privileges. Okay, minirant done. Here's what does work on debian with oss4, rhythmbox, GNU solfege, smplayer, xine and that's enough to keep me happy right now. Having to recompile multimedia apps on arch doesn't sound like much fun. One of the other reasons I switched from arch is that I got tired of my machine breaking on every second or third "pacman -Syu". Arch has a lot of packages but if they are in AUR you might as well flip a coin. Maybe it will build, maybe it won't. This new pulseaudio business with arch isn't very appealing to me. With all that complaining, I still have to say that I have a real fondness for arch and that community and I guess that nothings perfect. Still if anyone has a distro that they like besides arch or debian please let me know as I still like playing around with distros of all types just for fun. I don't have a spare machine but for those who like to tinker, clonezilla is a very handy tool.


Yes. Nothing is perfect. An ideal Linux distro may not exist.

It should not be a big problem to fix Audacity and JACK on Debian. Cesium claims that Debian is an ideal distro for OSS4 users. You may ask him how to fix the problems.

Do you have GeForce 8400?
In this case, you may need this instruction (for Arch):
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Be ... hics_Cards

The safe way to recompile Arch packages is to take the official package from ABS and modify PKGBUILD, for example:

Code: Select all
./configure --prefix=/usr --disable-pulse


The manual is here:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3543&start=30#p15703
See also:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4143
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby frabato56 » Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:27 am

Thanks igorzwx,

I do indeed have a GeForce 8400 so thanks for the link, I don't remember seeing that when I was having trouble. I've built packages from ABS to get rid of unnecessary (for me) KDE dependencies. If it's as simple as --disable-pulse, then maybe I'll give it another go. You also mentioned gentoo and while I promised myself that I would never do another gentoo install, maybe I'll try the minimal install sabayon. It could make it a lot easier to build everything without pulse. The other thing that looked interesting is debian/freebsd, the unix and open source worlds really are a lot of fun (sometimes). Thanks again to all.
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:08 pm

If you have GeForce 8400 and Windows, you may try EmanSIP softphone with InPhonex and tell us how it works.

EmanSIP softphone (win32), download here: http://sip.antisip.com/antisip/download ... update.exe
EmanSIP (macosx/intel), download here: http://sip.antisip.com/antisip/download ... -intel.dmg

Features:
H264 hardware decoder using NVIDIA GPU/NVIDIA Graphic cards
Windows Desktop Streaming
Video mixing (conference) with 9 participants
file transfer based on UDP
NEW: iphone support
http://www.antisip.com/as/services.php


InPhonex (USA, UK, Canada) ** Video Phone Capable **
Sign Up Here for free SIP service: http://www.inphonex.com/reg/free-voip-calls.php
(one InPhonex phone number per one email address)

Setup Tutorial: http://www.inphonex.com/support/setup-tutorial.php

Echo Test - Dial 600 Test your audio connection to the server.
Who Am I - Dial 8400 Say the phone number you are dialing from.
Voicemail - Dial 8500 Check your voicemail messages.
Conference Room - Dial 87+room number Join a conference call by dialing 87 + 3 digit room number (e.g. 87000)

SIP Configuration Settings SIP Pnones:

SIP Number/Username: [Your Inphonex Number]
Password: [Your Inphonex Password]
SIP Proxy Server: sip.inphonex.com

In a word, LinPhone works well with InPhonex
http://www.linphone.org/eng/download/
For VOIP encryption, you can use ZFone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zfone
http://zfoneproject.com/prod_zfone.html

Skype's VBR codec leaks information regardless of the quality of the encryption, which may allow phrases to be identified with an accuracy of 50-90%.
http://zfoneproject.com/faq.html#vbr
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby igorzwx » Mon May 02, 2011 2:35 pm

NEWS: "pulseaudio is now required to run the GNOME desktop" http://www.archlinux.org/news/gnome3-in-extra/

GNOME3 is replacing GNOME2
GNOME3 has two modes, "standard" mode (gnome-shell) and "fallback" mode (gnome-panel + metacity)
Some packages, like applets using Bonobo, will be dropped in the next few days...
pulseaudio is now required to run the GNOME desktop
http://www.archlinux.org/news/gnome3-in-extra/


To get rid of PulseAudio, you may need to recompile some packages, or change desktop environment https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/De ... vironments
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Re: Arch Linux is moving to PulseAudio (Gnome, KDE, etc.)

Postby a_username » Wed May 04, 2011 3:46 am

I'm running Arch, which has recently pushed GNOME3 out to its general population. After using GNOME3 for a bit, I noticed that pulse was running, but that it wasn't doing anything. OSS4 was still handling all the sound. The thing that tipped me off to this was that the volume buttons on the keyboard were no longer functioning. I still saw the OSD indicating that volume was going up or down, but it was pulse's volume that was changing. After some experimentation, I jumped in and removed pulse.

I can confirm that although GNOME3 lists pulseaudio as a dependency, you don't need it if you've got OSS4. I still have sound in Exaile, VLC, Vbox, Wine, and flash videos. Nothing has exploded. My only issue is that even with pulse totally wiped off the system, I still can't control OSS4's volume with the multimedia keys. I guess I have to go the, "bind scripts to the buttons," route from the FAQ. I'm gonna miss the OSD, though.
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